7. Epilogue

In a wrap up conversation Angela's baby sister Jackie and cousin Amy share their thoughts on the podcast with Executive Producer Kari Hargrave Southard and Host Julie Dove.  

Actress Julie Dove, also from Princeton, Texas, shares this very personal story of how Angela's murder changed the lives of Angela’s family and the small town forever.

Transcript

 This program contains descriptions of violence, drug use, and sexual themes.  

Previously, on True Texas Crime. I thought that when it was over, I would feel better. And I remember how it didn't make a difference. You know, like, nothing, nothing made us feel better. I mean, I do remember that feeling. I felt like, I felt like it was just months and months of being there because I'm a kid and you're young and your days weren't, were so long. I don't even know how many days we were there. I just, I remember the feeling of when it was over. I  Nothing felt over. I mean, it just, it didn't change anything. 

She was probably two months, maybe, about eight weeks. We painted our nails that night together and talked about it, and she disappeared two days later. She was happy that she was pregnant.  

My executive producer, Kari Hargrave Southern and I, interviewed Angela's baby sister Jackie and her best friend, cousin Amy, on August 28th, 2024, for a wrap up conversation about the podcast. Here's what they shared. 

This is True Texas Crime: The Significant Life of Angela Stevens. Episode 7: Epilogue. 

I want to just start off today by thanking you so, both so much Amy and Jackie and Kari for being, producer Kari, I'm calling you producer Kari, for uh, being here today and talking with us. I want to let you know that we are over 12,000 downloads as of this morning. It's um, amazing how many people every day just start listening.

Wow.

It's like three or four hundred a day. Which, when we put out each of the first episodes, it would be a lot on Thursday and Friday. And then the rest would trickle in, but we're just getting a solid amount every day, so I wanted to  

Wow. 

Celebrate that with you. 

That's a lot. 

Yeah, that we're getting Angela's story out. And I'm just gonna start. So, my first question is, uh, how are each of you feeling overall now that Angela's story is out in the world? 

Amy, you can go first. 

Okay. You know,  I feel like there has been so much healing on my end. Um, a lot of stuff that I had not dealt with, you know, at 16, I think you just kinda, you  Take everything in as best you can, um, and then move on.

And I think I've shoved a lot of stuff down and didn't deal with it at the time. And, um, I can tell you that speaking with my kiddos, I know that it affects. So it affected the way I parented all these years. Um, it affected my view on, you know. People that I probably could have trusted that didn't, um, and I think it, um, a lot of healing has happened on my end, I think. 

That's amazing. I'm so thankful that you can share that with us. Jackie, what are you feeling?

Uh, I, I, I'm, I don't know. I guess I'm kind of the opposite.It, it, it hasn't healed me at all. I think you, you guys did a wonderful job. I mean, there was so much more detail in that than I would have ever imagined, and the people you interviewed, they just said so many, they said wonderful things. I mean, I really did feel like more people did care because, you know, I felt like nobody from Princeton cares. So I know that there were definitely more people after you, you know, talked with everybody. But for me, I don't know. I  honestly don't think I'll ever heal. So it didn't really bring me peace, but I loved it. I think that y'all did a great job. And I'm glad that everybody gets to hear Angie's story because it's a big deal. It's definitely a big deal to me, but I don't know. It brings it back, but really it never left me anyway. So healing's not really the word for me. I'm sorry. I'm just kind of stumbling around. 

I'm, I'm, I'm probably even angrier, honestly, just because it's so fresh again, talking about it and hearing about it. And I guess that's really the only way that I can explain it. It makes me just want to go do more at this point in time with everything that's going on with the continuation of Lee now, like, uh, just real briefly, yesterday, they continued, they did a continuance, so he didn't actually get finished yesterday, so I'm kind of more on top of it again, instead of backing off like I did before, so I think it's really kind of a little more overwhelming to me. I'll try to wrap it up a little bit, but…

No, that's fine. Take your time. That's all I can say about it. 

I will say this much if I can. Yes, of course. We had a family reunion this past weekend, and it was at Jackie's. Thank you for hosting. 

You're welcome. 

Um, it was, it was kind of a, um, for me, it was like the first time that I felt that I could be around my entire family and think Angie would have loved this versus being bitter that Angie wasn't there.

And I think that was a big turning point for me because I've always felt being around my family because she should have been there. I was always a little bitter. 

Yeah. 

And this time I actually felt a little bit more, she would have loved to have been here and I miss her. But It at least gave me a little bit of, I didn't feel so bitter. 

That's great. I mean, it's important that we all have all the feelings. So, I mean, and everyone's feelings are valid. So, Jackie, listen, we all completely understand. I think I can speak for every listener and all of us. Well, tell us, what has the feedback been from maybe people that, are in your life that didn't know this about you? 

Well, I can tell you that I have had even my close, mainly my close friends, you know, which I expected them to call because every time, every Wednesday I get text. Hey, when's the next one? When's the next one? I'm sorry to bother you. I know you don't want to think about it, but when's the next one? So they were all just ready to hear it.

But I had people reach out to me that I don't really talk to on a regular basis. So actually, it wasn't a text. It wasn't email. It was a phone call and it was people saying, oh my God, I had no idea that you went through all of this. You know, most people know that, the background, but I had, I had a lot of people just call me to say, I love you and like you, we don't know how you did it. You know, I just had a lot of people call me and just really try to give me comfort. So I had people just really, really sweet to me. What, can I do anything for you? I'm like, no, I'm good. I appreciate the call. But so I got a lot of feedback. I got a lot of people really interested in watching it. That we're listening to it. I'm sorry. So Amy probably did too. 

I did. I got more. Um, again, I think it's 16. I didn't talk about it as much and I kind of held all that in. So, mine was more, I had no idea calls and, or text, or emails, or messages. It was just more, wow, we're shocked and that was more the feedback I got and, you know, definitely when it's the next episode and we're, you know, thanks so much for sharing this, which goes back to you, Kari and Julie. If it wasn't for you guys, we couldn't have even gotten this. So thank you for everything that you've done with this, because I think it was important. I think it was such an important story and it could have been, you know, we have Angela. But it could have been anybody. It could have been our kids. It could have been anybody.

Well, I'll tell you, I'll be honest with you guys, when y'all reached out to me in the beginning, I didn't want to do it, I just, I was nervous about it, I just didn't want to talk about it, and I told my husband I was going to not do it, and honestly, don't be mad at me, but I almost backed out at the last minute, and my husband was like, you need to do this. You need to, you need to, you need to just push through it. It'll help you and do it. So I was, I was really on the fence until like the night before you guys came to my house. So you probably weren't aware of that, but I almost backed out. 

Wow. 

I'm glad you didn't. 

I'm glad you didn't. I'm thankful. I'm thankful. So thankful. 

Oh, I'm, I'm so glad I, I didn't. Um, I just, I just, I, that's just something that I'm, I didn't think I would be able to get through it, so it, I'm glad I did. I'm glad I did. I think you guys did great. 

Thank you so much. Now, Amy, you had, kind of question for you because, you know, you had said that you cut out those, or you either cut out those friends in Richardson or you just didn't tell them about the murder. I want you to speak to that and then follow up with, did you hear from any of these friends from Princeton that you had not really stayed much in touch with, talking about from, from when you moved from Princeton? 

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. Um, you know, especially those people who really knew how close Angie and I were, you know, not just, not just cousins, but, you know, we were kind of inseparable in our group. And I, those people have reached out, whether it has been messages on Facebook, or, you know, emails or text messages. I have gotten a lot of, you know, we're really sorry kind of things and we should have done more. I never felt that way at the time. I just felt, um. You know, that I had kind of distanced myself, so it wasn't really on them either. Um, and I think, you know, we were all so young, nobody knew what to say. So, it's more of that, I wish I'd have known what to say, I wish I'd have known what to do. 

Yeah, I think going back to, you know, the several years ago when Kari and I started talking about this, I think as just an observer from the outside, I was angry and angry at the town and everything, which I mean, I still, you know, there's some things to be angry about, but I think one of the big lessons I've learned from all the people I've talked to is that Including myself, my own lesson that I don't think any, any of us knew what to do and I even said, you know, I think in that last episode that as a teacher, I would like to say I would have known what to say to you, Jackie, but I don't think I would have, you know.

Oh, yeah, I get it. 

I'm not really sure I knew what I'm not really sure I knew what to say to Jackie. I'm not sure I knew what to say to my aunt and uncle. It was just such a… 

Yeah.

Such a devastating time that I think we're all kind of in that same boat now that we've grown, matured. Of course, we would love to think that we would have done something differently, but again, when you're young and dumb, just because we didn't, hadn't been through anything like that, you know, I don't think that that,  you know, a real,  you know, don't feel guilty about it. We just didn't know any better. 

Yeah, and I think that other, for me, the important thing is, and the, you know, part of the message I hope I'm getting out is, it's for me in my life to know to reach out to people, even when I don't know what to say, and say, you know, I don't know what to say, I love you. And then, you know, the youths out there know to, like, talk to each other and to offer support to each other. Whatever that means. Sending a message or sending a funny TikTok. I don't know, but just Let people know you're there, you know? 

Yeah, I agree. Yeah, when I, I always reach out and say, you know, I have no idea what to say, but I'm here if you need anything.

Yeah. 

I had, uh, I had quite a few messages from a lot of people, really, from Princeton, and I got a lot of messages like, hey, I'm sorry, didn't know what to say. Your family's always been on my mind. Michael Armstrong was one of them. He was, I think, a year younger than me, and he, you probably don't remember me, but I did. And then Holly sent me a message, too. And Randall Morris, I actually talked to him a lot. He's always a great, uh, brings back lots of memories, actually, because he was really close to where we lived. So we did a lot with him. So I, it was good. It did feel good. That was a really good part of it for me that my people, not just my people here who knew me after, but the people who knew us then are reaching out and just, and I'm having regular conversations with a lot of those people now, just has your day and it's just really that part of it is really nice.  

Now, how have your kids, each of you felt about this podcast?  

My daughter has listened to it. She's busy little girl. So she's only like on episode three right now. And, um, it gets to her and I told her if it bothered her too much, you know, stop listening to it, but she's going to finish it out. Um, it breaks her little heart. She's actually really, really extra dupe, super duper sweeter to me. 

Wow.

Now, my son, he's not going to listen to it. Um, and my husband hasn't even listened to it. Um, I've talked to him about it as I hear them, but he's never really sat down and listened to it. But I think he will, um, but he, he, so I'm really not had too many conversations with my family members, my direct family members at home about it, my mother-in-law just calls me crying every time she hears it, because she just, you know, it just breaks her heart and she's very, very supportive of me. But other than my daughter, you know, in the house, they're not, they haven't listened to it just yet. 

Amy?  

My boys have not, I don't, you know, that I'm aware of have not yet listened and I think that both of them kind of are more binge listeners, if you want to know the truth. So I think once this final episode is done, um, they will kind of start listening to it and, and kind of see where they are. My husband has listened to it. Um. I think he's kind of, you know, on the journey with me because I feel like I'm just, I'm finally letting it all out. 

Yeah.

So he has been a complete supporter and, um, and just, and just right by my side on this whole thing. And, of course, Jackie, and I think we've talked a lot about it and, um, you know, kind of where we are with our feelings on it. And, um,  you know, but I think she's probably the person I've talked to the most about it. Yeah.

Absolutely. I mean, me and Amy have always talked, but we've definitely talked a lot more, and I feel to me, it's brought us a lot closer.

Absolutely.  For sure. 

Jackie, what do you think your parents would have thought about this podcast? 

Um, honestly, Dad would have never been able to get through anything. He would have never listened to it. Mom would have shielded him from it. Probably wouldn't even have told him about it. Um, it's weird. It was kind of taboo in our house. We didn't talk about it growing up. Angie's name, it's really sad, but she didn't feel like, live in our conversation. Um, it was just, we just didn't, we would have probably healed a lot better had we actually talked about it, but once she was gone, it was like we, we didn't, we didn't say her name anymore and it, sorry, that sucks, but we just didn't.

So I don't think she, my dad would have never been told about it. We would have all just shielded him from it. Now my mom, it would have helped her. I think it would have helped her a lot because, you know, she just kind of felt lonely and abandoned by everybody. I think it would have. Sorry, I'm getting emotional. Um, I think mom would've, mama would've liked it. 

She would have. 

It would have made, it would have made her feel like Angie was important.  

I agree. 

Really, when we started doing all this, it, you know, it makes you think about family more. Um, my, my, my family that I don't see, I mean, obviously mine are here all the time, but it makes, it made me really want to push getting us all together because that family that was here, that, that was us growing up. I mean, Shelly, Shawn, Shane, you know, out there, I mean, just seeing them kids, you know, here, and then they have their kids here. I mean, that was just heartwarming. I loved having them here. But I think us talking about the podcast and getting started with that really made me and Amy make that real move of, hey, let's get together. You know, there's one life here. Let's, let's always know that we love each other. Let's make it a point to be together, you know, as much as we can. So.
But, but back to the mom thing, I think she, she, I think it would have helped her. I mean, bottom line, I think she would have, I think she would have liked it and it would have warmed her heart and make, made her feel like Angie was important. And I wish she was here so she could have gotten that opportunity for sure.  

I'll just kind of add, you know, I think my mom would have really wanted to hear it too because  the last, um, Christmas, uh, I didn't get to go home the last Christmas that we had together, I'd been home a lot that year, but I came home like two weeks before Christmas in 2022, and Kari and I went out to the field where Angela's body was found. We were just kind of driving around and driving out to the bridge where the gun was, and we drove out to where we thought you guys lived, and my mom went with us and, and you know, she had dementia, but she just over and over again in the car, she kept saying, um, oh, that poor girl. Why would they have done that to her? So, um, yeah, it's, it's interesting how, you know, things like this just make us all connected. 

You're right, we're all connected. Everybody who lived in Princeton at that time, whether you knew us directly or not, um, we're bonded. I mean, it's just, it's something we all went through one way or another, and it's something that we will always remember, it's something we'll always have in our heart. It's definitely something that has, that connected all of us that were there at the time. 

Yeah, I think so too. If given the opportunity now after knowing more information, would you want to speak to Lee, Rodney, or John? Is there anything you'd ask them? 

No absolutely not. Y'all wouldn't want me in the same space with them. Um, no, nothing in me wants to have a conversation with them I have nothing to say to any of them. No. My answer is flat. No, Amy may feel differently, but not me. I couldn't have been same county with them.  

You know, I, I think and, um, Lee, as far as he's concerned, that wouldn't be that's a waste of air in my opinion. Um, no, I have nothing to say to him. The other tw, John and Rodney who, yes, I feel like they're just that every bit as guilty as he is, but, um, but I think my big question for them would be, was Lee worth it? Was Lee worth doing this for? You know, whatever, you know, um,  and then I, I think that, you know, they're off living their lives now. I think, I don't know, one of them's married for sure. The other one may be as well, and they're out living their, you know, lives. And, you know, I, the only thing I hope is, is that, you know, I hope every single day they see her face. That's all I can hope.  

I hope that every single day they wake up miserable and everything in their life is just horrid and the worst. That sounds harsh, but I don't care. Um, I don't want them to be happy. I don't want them to have a happy family life. I want them to struggle every day of their life and wish they were back in prison where they're supposed to be. I hope their lives are horrible. And that will never change.  

I think that's the hard part for me is that knowing that, first off, that Lee was even paroled early just really sends, you know, chills up my spine. How on earth could they, could they let him out? And then the other two again, how, how did they, how did they get such, you know, light sentences for murdering a 16 year old girl?  How did that happen?  

Well, that, that goes back to that interview with the, the, the lady who spoke. So, gosh, shoot, her letter. Her letter to the judge.

The juror.

Yeah. That, that part. I did not know that. And what was very, very, uh, fresh to me. And I want to grab that lady and hug her and tell her I love her. And thank you so much for standing your ground and doing what was right. When all of those other idiots that were back there were feeling sorry for that boy. I, that man, whatever. But I, her, her letter.

It was very powerful.

It got to me. It got to me because I didn't know. I didn't know that. I didn't know he was so close to actually just walking out the door that day and I'm very glad that he didn't because I promise you if he'd walked out that door, my dad would have murdered him. I, if he would have ever got the opportunity. I think that that would have happened. So yeah, I'm, very very thankful. 

I agree with that. Julie and I were also when we saw the letter, like we felt the same way like we… 

Absolutely. 

We didn't know about the letter. Did you Julie? 

No, I mean, I…

We were just, like we got to talk about this letter. 

We found it after quite a while of having all the documents and I was like, oh, my god, Kari… 

Wow.

Who is this woman in 1988 in Richardson, Texas, that stood up… 

I love her.

And, you know.

Yeah, we were very thankful that, you know, that she wrote the letter, that it specifically told us what behind the scenes, like Jackie said, and just, it made me, you know, thankful that there was at least someone there that saw everything that we see, right? 

Yeah, I'm glad we had a compassionate person who could see Angie side and not like I said, you know, you know how I felt and you made a story about it. You know, everybody's like those poor boys and and I didn't know that happened in the jury room. I mean, these are grown people. Most of them probably had their own children. How could you even get that close to letting him walk out the door? I mean, come on. So that was a, that hit me when I heard that. I actually listened to that probably five times. I just replayed it over and over again. And I am just thankful she existed.

Right.

And I'm thankful she was there. 

What would each of you say the most challenging part, or one of the most challenging part of this experience has been? 

I don't know. I guess really just kind of  putting it all out there for me. Um, I mean, y'all know I'm angry, so it's, I was, every time we would talk, I would try to not just sound like a raging maniac full of hate and, and obviously I didn't do a very good job, I guess, of that because of my emotions came through and it's still coming through. I mean, you can hear how I feel about things and them, but, um, I don't know. Amy, you go.

I, um. I honestly feel that the hardest part for me was the  last episode where new information was shared after 36 years. The hardest part for me for sure. Knowing that I spoke with Angela 3 days before she went missing. I spoke with her the morning of and that this information could have been shared with me for 36 years. That just, um, you know, and why wouldn't it have been, you know, so that. You know, very, that was tough to hear, that was tough, um, tough to believe, um, so that, that's definitely the hardest part for me. 

You talking about Angie being pregnant? 

Yeah, yeah, I was about to say, we can say it specifically, that's kind of my next question is, you know, we'll say the possible pregnancy, how have you been processing that information that Kimberly shared in her interview? 

For me, you know, I, you know, I, I, I didn't, I didn't, that, that, that surprised me. Um, the, the definitey of it, the, the part where she took a pregnancy test and Kim knew it, knew all about it. I'll tell you with, with mom, mom always suspected that was a possible, always a possibility. I mean, it was just a possibility in my mom's conversations with me. Um, she just said, you know, she could have been pregnant. Um, but it was never, mom didn't tell me she was pregnant and  mom and Angie were best friends. I mean, they were close, you know, mom, mom raised her like a little buddy. I think that if it was, I think my mom would have, would have known. If. I just, I feel like my mom would have known and my sister wouldn't have kept that from her.

Um,  But there's, you know, if she told my sister and, Kim, and that happened, I mean it happened and no, I wasn't aware. But my mom always thought it was a possibility always in the back of her mind, but mom never knew about a definitive pregnancy test, so, you know, so I don't know. It floored me when I heard it, yeah.

It floored us too.  

Because I, I didn't know. I didn't know that. I was never told that. So that's about all I can really say about that. 

It was definitely, um, like I said, floored, that's an understatement for me. Um, I think Angie and I, um, boy, did we keep each other's secrets and, um, I really felt like if, you know, had, had she been pregnant, I really feel like, um, there would have been no reason for her not to tell me.

Um, you know, there's, you know, just there would have been no reason. And I, so for that, that, that's a struggle for me, a real struggle. And I'm not saying it's not a possibility. Did she love him? Absolutely. Did she have sex with Lee? Absolutely. But for her not to tell me, um, and, and, you know, I mean, that might've just been something she wasn't ready to share. Which, if she wasn't ready to share, I don't know that she would have been sharing it with anybody, not just me, you know, so, um, I have questions. Um, and, um, you know, and the biggest one is in 36 years, how come this is the first time I've heard that? 

You know, the whole reason allegedly that Lee did this is because Angie was going to narc on him. Do you feel that this adds another reason that's a possibility as to why they would have done such a horrific…  

Well, of course, I mean, it's always a possibility, but, you know, I, I honestly feel like, you know, if that were the case, wouldn't the prosecutors have gone after them for capital murder at this point for the murder of a, you know, uh, an unborn fetus and, uh, and, uh, you know, the mother? I mean, that just, to me, that just never made sense that, that, you know, that they wouldn't have at least attempted that or tried that, you know…

We're going to try to confirm if a pregnancy test had to be requested specifically, or if that was part of a routine autopsy, because it's not listed as a line item on the autopsy at all. We don't know if she was tested for that. And then I think Kari can maybe speak to a tiny bit of information on there wasn't a law that allowed to prosecute for a pregnant woman's fetus.

Right. Lacey's law that happened, I believe, to where the now after her murder, you know, if you were pregnant now you were charged differently, but back in 1988 there was nothing.  

A point of information for our listeners. Even if the medical examiner tested improved Angela was pregnant at the time of her murder, there was no law in place to allow prosecution for the murder of Angela's unborn baby. The Unborn Victims of Violence Act of 2004, Public Law 108 212, also known as Lacey and Conner's Law, is named after murder victims Lacey Peterson and her unborn child Conner Peterson. Lacey's husband Scott Peterson was convicted by a jury in 2004 for the murder of both Lacey and Conner. The United States law recognizes an embryo or fetus in utero as a legal victim if they are injured or killed during the commission of any of over 60 listed federal crimes of violence.

Another interesting point is that previous versions of the law were passed in the House of Representatives in 1999 and 2001, but failed to pass the Senate. 

But I mean, it definitely, that, that stuck with me. I would. I would, you know, now I'm, I'm in a position to where I want to know. I wish there was a way for me to really know if she was or not. I mean, she's gone. It's not going to change anything, but I would, I would like to know. I mean, literally, it just seems kind of morbid, but I've literally thought of ways like, Hey, can we. Can we exhume her? Can we take it out? Can we test her? Um, and if that was even possible. 

I thought the same thing. 

I thought that too. I've got too much Law and Order in my head, but when you were like, I wish there was a way we could know, my immediate thought was, can, can we exhume her, as if I had any say?

I would do it, if, if, I would want to do it, if, if it was a possibility. I, I would pay to do it. I would pay any amount of money to do it, just to know, even though it wouldn't change a thing, at least we would know. We would just know.

I mean, it wouldn't change anything at all, but it just definitely puts a different perspective on it. It makes the note sound differently. I need to talk to Lee. You know, that, that gives me a whole different connotation of that note, if that's what part of that is. Or I go back to, you know, did she suspect it when he tried to run her over by the Pace Picante Sauce building? Is that what that fight was about? I don't know.  None of us know. Angela's the only one that knows, you know?  

I was always curious how far you were going to go with this, because, you know, you've interviewed us and you've interviewed, you know, everybody. And I was wondering if you were going to take that next step and approach him or the other guys and ask for an interview. And I'm really conflicted with it, I'll be honest, because I don't even want them to speak. But I was curious if you were going to go further with that in the future. 

Well, we're, we're conflicted with it, too. We've had conversations, and our conversations are, we're going to talk about it, and we're going to talk to you about it, too, because, you know, we're not, we're here to continue to honor Angela's memory. That's our, that's our number one priority. So, we'll all just talk about it and make some decisions…

Right.

On what we think is best to keep learning more. 

I wonder if this is true, right, it's a possibility. None of us know. Rodney and John, I bet, had no idea. We'll never know  but I'm just like it changes so many things that that one thing changes so many things and we also, you know, like I said, we didn't know until the interview either, you know, 

I'm thankful like I said to Kimberly that she reached out on Facebook just to, you know, she reached out to thank me and I said, you know, can I interview and she said, yes, and I think you can tell from the interview, you know, she provided that information unprovoked and very early in the interview. I will say it felt to me like, my dad is gone and I can let go of this secret and I go back to Episode 3: The Secrets We Keep and how we let things torture us because when I told my story in episode three, that's the first time that I told a large group of people. I never told my mother, you know, so I felt like. I told my mother after that. 

Mm hmm. Well, and I felt the same way with Kim. I mean, it shocked me. Um, she never said it to me before. She never prepared me for it. You know, I, I didn't know what I was getting into, so when I heard it, you know, I  went, you know, and  You, you, you are probably right. It's something that she's, she's held in her entire life and she just wanted, you know, dad being gone. Yeah, that may have made the difference. I don't know. I just wish I really knew for sure 100 percent if Angie really did have a baby in her belly when she was murdered or not.  

Yeah. And for anyone listening that might be like, well, why isn't Kimberly on this conversation now? And it's because of that, you know, Kari and I, this project started with you, Jackie and Amy, and, you know, we've always considered it like a partnership between you guys. And so it's not that Kimberly's not welcome. It's just that this is kind of the core group of the podcast, you know, wrapping up what's happened. So. We love you, Kimberly. 

Oh, of course. 

For sure. 

Yeah.  

I love you, Kimberly.  

Amy, did you have anything else you want to say? I don't want to cut you off if you?

No, no, no, no, no. I'm  still taking it all in. Sorry. 

No, it's okay. Listen,  I, I think it's something to process for a long, long time. So, but I want to make sure you feel like you have the opportunity to say whatever, however you feel like.  

Thank you. No, I, you know, I, at the reunion, I was not going to, you know, bring this up with Kim at all. And, you know, I did tell her that, you know, I think that no matter what, you know, it's still a shock to me that, you know, Angela could have been pregnant. Um, that's a shock. But what's really a shock is the fact that 36 years went by and I never heard this and that, so it was the, it was the blind side on top of the blind side, if you wanna know the truth. So that's what it felt like, and… 

Yeah. 

To me, the possibility was always there. Um, that, that part didn't surprise me at all. The possibility was always there. The, the part that was surprising to me was the, the definite, we took a pregnancy test and I knew about it kind of thing and that part was not anything I had ever been told before and  but the part of their being pregnant that that's something that that was always a possibility. We all knew that. I mean, mom always said, you know, she she could have been pregnant. So that that part didn't surprise me. It was the part about, we took a pregnancy test together and that was new to me. That was brand spanking new to me.  

A note to our listeners. We spoke via email to Dr. William Rohr, now retired Collin County Medical Examiner.

An email from Dr. Rohr dated August 29, 2024 included the following: 

Miss Dove, I still remember this case. I was at the scene of discovery. Angela died of a shotgun wound. Other homicidal violence could not be established because of the condition of her remains. Establishing pregnancy at death requires a full autopsy. With visualization of the pregnancy in the uterine cavity, or in rare cases, a fallopian tube. In Angela's case, none of these structures remained for examination. A pregnancy test is normally done on urine. Blood testing can also be done. Urine is preferred.  There was no urine or blood available, again because of the condition of Angela's remains. An exhumation would add nothing to establish or rule out pregnancy. 

In summary, Angela being pregnant at death cannot be ruled in or out because of the advanced decomposition of her body when found 11 days later. If the pregnancy test given to her shortly before death was positive, there is nothing in the autopsy report to refute this. Dr. Rohr. 

Several of our listeners asked how it could be determined that Angela did not have drugs or alcohol in her system at the time of death. I sent a follow up email asking how drug testing was reliable if it was done approximately 11 days after her death. Dr. Rohr explained. that due to the lack of blood in urine, skeletal muscle was used for these tests. And regarding accuracy, he stated, drugs and skeletal muscle should have still been present after 11 days. If the skeletal muscle is all negative for drugs, then I would consider Angela to be free of drugs at the time of death. 

What was the most positive part of this experience? 
The most positive part for me was hearing everyone remember Angie. You know, it's almost like whenever I would hear them talk about her and her laugh. Oh my gosh, I could, I could hear it just listening to them and her smile and how she was always bubbly.

And you know, she was, you know, Angie could walk in a room and command the entire room. And those are the things I remember. And it was so good to hear other people remember her the same way.  

Oh, I have to piggyback off that because that's how I feel too. Uh, I love the comments about how, from her teachers, from her friends, you know, how she was just, like sunshine. Something of that sort was said. You know, she was always smiling. She was just always happy. And that's how I remembered her. So I loved it that everybody saw that. I like it that that's how everybody saw her too. It wasn't, it was positive. I mean, how she was just cheerful and she was just a ray of sunshine.

And that's how I felt about her. When I was a kid, I thought she was awesome, and I love it that everybody got to see that, and they told me that, so, well, not told me that, but said that about her, so, that, I, I, I agree with Amy, I mean, that's, that's the positive for me. 

Absolutely. 

I can also share that so many people that have reached out to me that don't know y'all, they're not from Princeton, that now know Angie. And they just can't believe the story, and they're just, I just feel like, you know, it was kind of neat to let other people know her, know about her.  

Exactly.

And I hope that y'all feel that too. 

Absolutely. 

Absolutely. She is, she is not forgotten. And that's how I  always  felt, you know, I always felt like we're the only ones who think about her. We're the only ones who thought she was awesome. But through all of this, I found out everybody thought she was great, you know, and that, that was the best, really. Yeah. 

Each of you, is there like any final thought, like, oh, I want to say this to, to whoever, whatever. I just want to offer you an opportunity to, to button up in any way that you, that you would like. And then Kari and I will jump in with some final thoughts each.  

Jackie, I'll let you go first.  

I really just want to thank everybody who, who chipped in on this and was willing to talk and speak with you guys when you, you know, reached out to them for interviews because, you know, a lot of people don't like to talk and do things like that, including me. I, like I said, I wasn't going to do it and I just wanted, I want to reach out and just say thank you to everybody who, who got on there and just talked about her. Um, I thought it was, it was very nice and I'm glad, I'm glad that they did it. I'm grateful for it. 

I agree. I just feel that, you know, we, um, 36 years, we've kind of all, you know, gone our separate ways and, and, you know, we have our memories of Angie, but it was so great to hear other people speak of her and that wanted to participate and wanted to talk about it.

And, uh, and it's not an easy subject. I mean, it's hard and, but they did it and they, you know, took the time and you think back to, you know, back to Larry Dennison and the, you know, the jurors and, you know, all her, the people who knew her and, uh, that everybody was so willing to participate, um, has really been so helpful and just so, you know, therapeutic for us, I think, um, and I think that's really helped me the most. 

I want to thank everyone that agreed to be interviewed, and I think the people that considered it, but didn't feel like they could do it for whatever reason and I hope that those people find the healing that they need for whatever reason why they feel like they couldn't share and I thank you, each of you, all three of you so much for trusting me and for, you know, allowing me to interject a little bit of my personal experiences and how I felt connected to Angela all these years.

And you've provided me with a lot of healing, and you've helped me change and grow personally in a way that I never had before, and I'm just, I'm super, I'm super grateful to all of you. 

Yeah, I'm grateful for you guys too. 

On behalf of our entire family, I think I can say, um, Kari and Julie, to trust you with this story. I don't know that anybody else could have done it, and anybody else could have done it justice the way you did. Um, and putting it out there for us, um, and making it a safe space for us to talk about, um, that's incredible. And the fact that you did it with such grace and integrity, and we just really appreciate you. We appreciate you both. Thank you. 

Yes, thank you. 

Thank each of y'all too. I do appreciate, you know, when we brought this idea to y'all. I know, Jackie, I now know you were a little bit more apprehensive. What's interesting is, um, like Jackie's one of the main reasons I got involved in this story when Julie and I talked years ago is because I am the little sister. I have two older sisters. And of course, everyone knows by listening to the podcast that my sister Holly was extremely close to Angie. And so, when, Jackie probably doesn't know this, but like, I super felt what Jackie felt, obviously not to the extent, but I'm saying, and it's always bothered me since it happened.

It was a very pivotal moment in my childhood when we would go play Maybank in Princeton. We would play them in basketball, volleyball, whatever. I would look for her. I always, uh. Always searched you and your family out because it was so hard. And to this day, when my daughter plays Maybank, I mean, until we knew where you were located, I would always be like, I wonder where she's at. 

Thank you for letting us tell such a, you know, such a very important story that could happen today. These things still go on, and that's why it's important to tell the story. 

Yes. It happens everywhere. It happens all the time. 

Yeah. Thank you. 

So, thank y'all for letting us do that. 

We don't want there to be forgotten victims. Every victim's story deserves to be told. 

Thank you all so much. 

Thank you. 

I wish we were, uh, there in Malakoff and could go get some Mexican food. All right, well, uh, I love all of y'all, we appreciate it. 

Thank you. 

All right. 

Love you guys. 

Yes, you guys be safe. 

Okay. Bye bye. 

Please like and follow True Texas Crime: The Significant Life of Angela Stevens, wherever you get your podcasts, as we will post bonus episodes, including updates on the new sentencing of Angela's murderer, Lee Henson. 

True Texas Crime: The Significant Life of Angela Stevens, is a North End Burgers production.  

Recorded, hosted, and written by me, Julie Dove.  

Kari Southard Hargrave is the Executive Producer. 

Studio recording by Mike DeLay at Real Voice LA. 

Sound design and mixing by Real Voice LA. 

Additional recording by JBM Studios.

Opening music, “The Colonel,” courtesy of Zachariah Hickman. 

Closing music, “Night in the Prairie,” courtesy of Derek and Brandon Fiechter. 

Special thanks to Jackie Stevens Tower, Amy Harper Fritz, Deanna McDonald, and Jennifer Rich. 

The views expressed by this podcast host and participants are solely that of the person speaking and do not necessarily reflect the views of any employer, company, institution, or other associated parties.